Sandman

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Eolh
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Postby Eolh » Thu Jul 15, 2004 4:57 pm

Dynagrip wrote:I didn't know how he was using graphic novel. I believe some people use it to mean more serious comic books in general, regardless of the binding format.


Eolh wrote:Just finished through Sandman TPB #10. Neil Gaiman just kicked my ass. A work of art.
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Postby Dynagrip » Thu Jul 15, 2004 5:02 pm

I skim through your posts because I hate you.

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Postby Bag of Ass » Thu Jul 15, 2004 5:42 pm

Eolh wrote:Just finished through Sandman TPB #10. Neil Gaiman just kicked my ass. A work of art.

The page with Thessaly (I think that's her name) where she was talking about Morpheus and saying that she promised she'd never shed another tear for him...that page almost made me cry. Like this!

:cry:

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Postby Eolh » Thu Jul 15, 2004 5:50 pm

Me too actually, that was a great panel... :cry:
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Postby Luminaire » Thu Jul 15, 2004 6:40 pm

Gobo wrote:Stardust is still my favourite


I have to agree.

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Postby shorty » Fri Jul 16, 2004 1:55 am

Dynagrip wrote:
Shorty wrote:
Eolh wrote:
Anyone who says that "comics" can't be literature has never read The Sandman.


Yeah. The only reason Bill Watterson (Calvin & Hobbes) isn't on my list of kings is because of his views on comics. He outright said they're all garbage, every one of them, in the Tenth Anniversary Book. He obviously hasn't read Sandman.

I think he just said super hero comics.


He used the term 'graphic novels', man.
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Postby Too-Much-Coffee Mistress » Fri Jul 16, 2004 4:47 am

Bag of Ass wrote:The page with Thessaly (I think that's her name) where she was talking about Morpheus and saying that she promised she'd never shed another tear for him...that page almost made me cry. Like this!

:cry:


Yes, that's her name. Total bitch. Has kept herself alive since ye olde cavewoman days through deals with various entities. Apparently not scared of anything, God and Lucifer included. I like that scene after Morpheus leaves her apartment for the final time, blowing out her windows. "Men!"
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Postby nobody_important » Fri Jul 16, 2004 6:28 am

Oh no, she was most definitely afraid of that void thing in the mini-series they just did.
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Postby Too-Much-Coffee Mistress » Fri Jul 16, 2004 6:56 am

The Tharmic Null? Yeah, but since it was technically NO-thing, you could still say she was afraid of... eh, nevermind. I think she was half-amazed that someone had finally found a way to kill her.

That mini-series almost managed to make her, dare I say, endearing.
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Postby nobody_important » Fri Jul 16, 2004 7:53 am

Yes, and she didn't nail a single person's face to the wall the entire time. I felt sad, and strangely cheated.
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Postby Eolh » Fri Jul 16, 2004 2:49 pm

Too-Much-Coffee Mistress wrote:The Tharmic Null? Yeah, but since it was technically NO-thing, you could still say she was afraid of... eh, nevermind. I think she was half-amazed that someone had finally found a way to kill her.

I just said like 10 posts ago that I hadn't read anything besides the ten Sandman TPBs. And we have that nifty new spoiler tag. Grrr...Arrgh...
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Postby nobody_important » Fri Jul 16, 2004 5:29 pm

Eolh wrote:I just said like 10 posts ago that I hadn't read anything besides the ten Sandman TPBs. And we have that nifty new spoiler tag. Grrr...Arrgh...


Seriously, that didn't spoil anything. You should still read it.
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Postby Square721BT » Fri Jul 16, 2004 6:02 pm

It spoiled my dinner. Now I have trichinosis.

Re-read the Thessalian part and enjoyed it. In the spirit of Square's Crying Girl Icons, I made a temporary icon.

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Postby Eolh » Mon Jul 19, 2004 2:35 pm

Bought and finished Endless Nights, Death: The High Cost of Living, and Death: The Time of Your Life yesterday.

I really liked Endless Nights. Some explaining of things, not as much as you want though (to keep me wanting more). I know it's not the point, but I really wanna see some more of the new Dream's reign over the Dreaming. I also want to know more about the original Despair and how her leaving all came about.

I really enjoyed the two Death books too. I even liked the AIDS awareness section, and I don't know why. Death is such a great character.

Yay for Neil Gaiman! After Anansi Boys (his latest novel of which he's supposedly about half done with) he's got another project with Marvel lined up. I read his 1602 series and that was pretty good. I think he works better with his own characters though.
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Postby Bag of Ass » Mon Jul 19, 2004 3:22 pm

Eolh wrote:...but I really wanna see some more of the new Dream's reign over the Dreaming.

Even though I don't like him as much, I get the sense that Daniel will make a better Dream than Morpheus did. He is sensitive to other people, something Morpheus definitely was not. What I wanted to see was how his relationships with the other Endless would've turned out. Dream was closest with Death, and I think Death could basically get along great with everyone, but it just wouldn't be the same. If you'll recall, Morpheus was long ago closest with Desire. How do you suspect it would be with Daniel?

And Gaiman does projects with Marvel? I thought he was strictly a DC/Vertigo kind of guy.

I recommended Neil Gaiman to a guy at work. He borrowed and enjoyed my Death: The High Cost of Living, and he bought Neverwhere and American Gods, which he has started.

You know, if I were to name the volumes, I would've switched The High Cost of Living with The Time of Your Life. In HCOL, Death spends one day as a mortal, ie. has the time of her life. In TOYL, there is a price to pay, ie. a high cost.

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Postby Eolh » Mon Jul 19, 2004 3:31 pm

I loved Morpheus, and the thing I loved most about him was that he wasn't loveable. He was kind of a jerk, and he always thought/knew he was right about everything. And I loved that in the end [spoiler]he recognized that the process of change was too hard for him and decided to end it, instead[/spoiler].

I don't know if I'd like Daniel as much (if I did it'd be for obviously different reasons), but the contrasts between the two different (yet singular) entities would be highly entertaining. But yeah, just like with Morpheus, the really interesting parts are examining the relationships between the Endless.

Dream's story from Endless Nights was really interesting, I thought. It's weird to see the Endless when they were "young". That Dream and Desire got along well isn't all that surprising (naturally the two would seem to get along together well), but it was a little neat bit of juxtaposition from where they had been throughout the entire Sandman run.

Yeah, Gaiman wrote the 9 part miniseries for Marvel called 1602, which was basically a glorified "What If?" series about the Marvel Universe and it's key players existing in the year 1602 instead of now. Interesting and well-written.

He's contracted for another project, but Neil and Joe Queseda (Editor-in-Chief at Marvel) have agreed to postpone it until the current novel is done.
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Postby Bag of Ass » Mon Jul 19, 2004 3:50 pm

Eolh wrote:Dream's story from Endless Nights was really interesting, I thought. It's weird to see the Endless when they were "young".

I agree. They weren't really young though, just younger. Delerium was Delerium, not Delight. It is interesting how they showed her as a little girl in that story, while the rest of them do not physically age. I don't remember if Destruction was in that story, if he was still part of the Endless at that point. And was it the first instance of Despair?

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Postby Eolh » Mon Jul 19, 2004 4:06 pm

Bag of Ass wrote:
Eolh wrote:Dream's story from Endless Nights was really interesting, I thought. It's weird to see the Endless when they were "young".

I agree. They weren't really young though, just younger. Delerium was Delerium, not Delight. It is interesting how they showed her as a little girl in that story, while the rest of them do not physically age. I don't remember if Destruction was in that story, if he was still part of the Endless at that point. And was it the first instance of Despair?


I'll have to re-read but I'm 90% sure that Delerium WAS Delight in that story. Destruction was there and was a working member of the Endless. He was jovial and nice, just like you'd expect. And yeah, the Despair in that story was the first Despair.

Another thing that just occured to me. In Destiny's garden there are the statues of the 7 Endless. The picture of the Dream statue covering his face with his hands, and Destruction with his back turned is really haunting.
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Postby Square721BT » Mon Jul 19, 2004 8:20 pm

Bag of Ass wrote:Even though I don't like him as much, I get the sense that Daniel will make a better Dream than Morpheus did. He is sensitive to other people, something Morpheus definitely was not.

Morpheus' sensitivity killed him. Where the Endless are concerned, sensitivity is a definite detriment. Remember that the new Dream is also kind of the old Dream -- he has some of the memories and experiences of the old Dream. With any luck, he'll learn to balance sensitivity and responsibility, so that he can learn to live with himself. (You know, inasmuch as the Endless "live".)

If you'll recall, Morpheus was long ago closest with Desire. How do you suspect it would be with Daniel?

I would assume he would treat Desire with caution.
And Gaiman does projects with Marvel? I thought he was strictly a DC/Vertigo kind of guy.

He doesn't like Marvel much, and Vertigo has some pretty big benefits (Being nice to him, not forcing him to pay extra for decent, non-newsprint paper, Creator Ownership, Willingness to Novelize a story arc, etc.) But I think he goes where his interest (and possibly his finances) take him.

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Postby Square721BT » Mon Jul 19, 2004 8:24 pm

Eolh wrote:I'll have to re-read but I'm 90% sure that Delerium WAS Delight in that story. Destruction was there and was a working member of the Endless. He was jovial and nice, just like you'd expect. And yeah, the Despair in that story was the first Despair.

She was, and he was, and she was. It was the creation of the universe. Most of the stars were just being born, and they were deciding on how the physical laws should work. (I thought that was cute -- because physics was supposedly a somewhat different thing very close to the big bang than it is now.)


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